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	<title>Comments on: Music is settled! (Well, almost&#8230;)</title>
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	<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/</link>
	<description>One of the Good Shepherd's flock. Just hanging around, blogging, and eating my grass.</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 11:02:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Stephanie</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-7207</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephanie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 19:49:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-7207</guid>
		<description>Yay for good music!! Sounds LOVELY! I didn't even pick any of my music, lol, but luckily it was nice (they don't do haugen/haas in France so at least I didn't have to worry about that!) 

And we came down the aisle together, I really love that we did. Of course, I couldn't have had my dad give me away if I'd wanted to, as he didn't come to the wedding, lol, and it's more common to come down the aisle together in France anyway.

How exciting! :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yay for good music!! Sounds LOVELY! I didn&#8217;t even pick any of my music, lol, but luckily it was nice (they don&#8217;t do haugen/haas in France so at least I didn&#8217;t have to worry about that!) </p>
<p>And we came down the aisle together, I really love that we did. Of course, I couldn&#8217;t have had my dad give me away if I&#8217;d wanted to, as he didn&#8217;t come to the wedding, lol, and it&#8217;s more common to come down the aisle together in France anyway.</p>
<p>How exciting! <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: jean</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6798</link>
		<dc:creator>jean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jul 2008 23:55:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6798</guid>
		<description>Sara, I wondered if you'd share the passage from Tobit that you're using.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sara, I wondered if you&#8217;d share the passage from Tobit that you&#8217;re using.</p>
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		<title>By: Sara</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6771</link>
		<dc:creator>Sara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Jul 2008 02:05:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6771</guid>
		<description>I was the recipient of a "divine slap upside the head" while reading one of the passages from Tobit during adoration one day so it's important to me to have the Tobit passage :-)

I want my recessional to be &lt;i&gt;Joyful, Joyful&lt;/i&gt;.  I'm a member of the parish handbell choir (and may be directing it in the fall if no other acceptable director is found) and I have visions of getting my pals in the choir to learn how to play it for the recessional :)

Other than my non-negotiables, I'm letting Adam take control of the ceremony choices and I'm reserving veto power.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was the recipient of a &#8220;divine slap upside the head&#8221; while reading one of the passages from Tobit during adoration one day so it&#8217;s important to me to have the Tobit passage <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
I want my recessional to be <i>Joyful, Joyful</i>.  I&#8217;m a member of the parish handbell choir (and may be directing it in the fall if no other acceptable director is found) and I have visions of getting my pals in the choir to learn how to play it for the recessional <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
Other than my non-negotiables, I&#8217;m letting Adam take control of the ceremony choices and I&#8217;m reserving veto power.</p>
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		<title>By: Kasia</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6754</link>
		<dc:creator>Kasia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:47:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6754</guid>
		<description>Sara - thanks!! I love the readings from Tobit, though Canuck and I are leaning towards either Proverbs or Sirach...well, last we talked about it, anyway.  ;-)

Our parish wedding coordinator said that they tried doing the couple greeting guests thing, but that it gave rise to too many complications and that they therefore strongly recommend against it. Canuck really liked the idea, but when she told us about the logistical issues that had come up in the past, he agreed not to do it.

Out of curiosity, what is your non-negotiable recessional?  :-)  (I really wanted Clarke's &lt;i&gt;Trumpet Voluntary&lt;/i&gt; for either the processional or the recessional, but Canuck wasn't wild about it, so we compromised.  :-p)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sara - thanks!! I love the readings from Tobit, though Canuck and I are leaning towards either Proverbs or Sirach&#8230;well, last we talked about it, anyway.  <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Our parish wedding coordinator said that they tried doing the couple greeting guests thing, but that it gave rise to too many complications and that they therefore strongly recommend against it. Canuck really liked the idea, but when she told us about the logistical issues that had come up in the past, he agreed not to do it.</p>
<p>Out of curiosity, what is your non-negotiable recessional?  <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' />  (I really wanted Clarke&#8217;s <i>Trumpet Voluntary</i> for either the processional or the recessional, but Canuck wasn&#8217;t wild about it, so we compromised.  :-p)</p>
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		<title>By: Kasia</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6753</link>
		<dc:creator>Kasia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:42:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6753</guid>
		<description>Jean - I'm not sure whether it's a Protestant tradition &lt;i&gt;per se&lt;/i&gt; - it may be. From my research, it &lt;i&gt;does&lt;/i&gt; seem to be a specifically Anglo-Saxon tradition (though quite a few other cultures have similar customs - but that's how it's been handed down in the US). 

The most common critique is that it is a throwback to the Anglo-Saxon bride being the chattel of her father, thus the necessity for his consent and "giving" her to the groom (for a price). I've also read some resources that claim the tradition goes back to the bride's father making sure the groom actually MARRIES her, rather than simply abducting her and...well, you know.  ;-)

More modern justifications for keeping the tradition center around the Biblical concept of the two becoming one: that "she shall leave her father's house and cleave to her husband, and the two shall become one flesh". Thus it is the bride leaving her family of origin and joining her husband; and the father giving her away is a sign of his blessing. Which is fine, and a very nice piece of symbolism. I mean, the wedding veil is said to have originated in pagan Rome, so I'm not going to get too hung up on the origins of every custom.

For the benefit of anyone still reading this thread... :-)

The main reason the bishops cite for recommending that the two process in together (with or without their parents) is twofold:

- The bride is very often, nowadays, not leaving her parents' house as she was in previous generations. She's usually done so quite a few years before, to go live on her own. So the imagery of her leaving her parents' home to cleave to her husband usually doesn't mesh with the reality. It doesn't mean it can't be a touching symbol, but it's an inaccurate reflection of the actual change taking place in her life.

- Going back to the origin of the tradition for a moment, the bride as transferred property (which yes, I understand is not the way most people actually VIEW it now) is not in keeping with the idea behind a Christian marriage. And it's not just Anglo-Saxon fathers who had autocratic say-so over whom their daughters married; if you look at the early Christians, there are quite a few martyrs like St. Anastasia who were forced by pagan fathers to marry pagan men. In contrast to that, the Christian idea of marriage is supposed to be two consenting adults freely coming together to enter into the Sacrament. (In my understanding, that's why a marriage can be canonically annulled if one of the parties was, for some reason, not in possession of the full faculties required to enter into the Sacrament, or if there was coercion.)

Now. Does having my dad walk me down the aisle take away from that? It doesn't have to, no. But the bishops' point is that having the bride and groom process in together, with or without their parents, is a more accurate symbolic reflection of what is actually taking place. Which is why they recommend it.  :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jean - I&#8217;m not sure whether it&#8217;s a Protestant tradition <i>per se</i> - it may be. From my research, it <i>does</i> seem to be a specifically Anglo-Saxon tradition (though quite a few other cultures have similar customs - but that&#8217;s how it&#8217;s been handed down in the US). </p>
<p>The most common critique is that it is a throwback to the Anglo-Saxon bride being the chattel of her father, thus the necessity for his consent and &#8220;giving&#8221; her to the groom (for a price). I&#8217;ve also read some resources that claim the tradition goes back to the bride&#8217;s father making sure the groom actually MARRIES her, rather than simply abducting her and&#8230;well, you know.  <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>More modern justifications for keeping the tradition center around the Biblical concept of the two becoming one: that &#8220;she shall leave her father&#8217;s house and cleave to her husband, and the two shall become one flesh&#8221;. Thus it is the bride leaving her family of origin and joining her husband; and the father giving her away is a sign of his blessing. Which is fine, and a very nice piece of symbolism. I mean, the wedding veil is said to have originated in pagan Rome, so I&#8217;m not going to get too hung up on the origins of every custom.</p>
<p>For the benefit of anyone still reading this thread&#8230; <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>The main reason the bishops cite for recommending that the two process in together (with or without their parents) is twofold:</p>
<p>- The bride is very often, nowadays, not leaving her parents&#8217; house as she was in previous generations. She&#8217;s usually done so quite a few years before, to go live on her own. So the imagery of her leaving her parents&#8217; home to cleave to her husband usually doesn&#8217;t mesh with the reality. It doesn&#8217;t mean it can&#8217;t be a touching symbol, but it&#8217;s an inaccurate reflection of the actual change taking place in her life.</p>
<p>- Going back to the origin of the tradition for a moment, the bride as transferred property (which yes, I understand is not the way most people actually VIEW it now) is not in keeping with the idea behind a Christian marriage. And it&#8217;s not just Anglo-Saxon fathers who had autocratic say-so over whom their daughters married; if you look at the early Christians, there are quite a few martyrs like St. Anastasia who were forced by pagan fathers to marry pagan men. In contrast to that, the Christian idea of marriage is supposed to be two consenting adults freely coming together to enter into the Sacrament. (In my understanding, that&#8217;s why a marriage can be canonically annulled if one of the parties was, for some reason, not in possession of the full faculties required to enter into the Sacrament, or if there was coercion.)</p>
<p>Now. Does having my dad walk me down the aisle take away from that? It doesn&#8217;t have to, no. But the bishops&#8217; point is that having the bride and groom process in together, with or without their parents, is a more accurate symbolic reflection of what is actually taking place. Which is why they recommend it.  <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: djrakowski</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6749</link>
		<dc:creator>djrakowski</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:30:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6749</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;He said, in his Slovak accent “I think your family thinks, perhaps, too much about politics.” ROFL! Talk about your understatements…&lt;/i&gt;
Ha! My pastor is the &lt;b&gt;king&lt;/b&gt; of understatement!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>He said, in his Slovak accent “I think your family thinks, perhaps, too much about politics.” ROFL! Talk about your understatements…</i><br />
Ha! My pastor is the <b>king</b> of understatement!</p>
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		<title>By: Sara</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6732</link>
		<dc:creator>Sara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 01:22:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6732</guid>
		<description>Adam and I are undecided as to whether we're processing in together or whether we're walking in each accompanied by our parents.  I personally lean towards the former. 

I really like the idea of the couple greeting the guests at the door of the church so we're going to try to do that. 

I really only have two non-negotiables regarding the ceremony--I know what music I want for the recessional and the first reading has to be one of the selections from Tobit (there's some backstory there) :)

Your idea sounds neat and I may have to copy some of your music selections!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Adam and I are undecided as to whether we&#8217;re processing in together or whether we&#8217;re walking in each accompanied by our parents.  I personally lean towards the former. </p>
<p>I really like the idea of the couple greeting the guests at the door of the church so we&#8217;re going to try to do that. </p>
<p>I really only have two non-negotiables regarding the ceremony&#8211;I know what music I want for the recessional and the first reading has to be one of the selections from Tobit (there&#8217;s some backstory there) <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
Your idea sounds neat and I may have to copy some of your music selections!</p>
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		<title>By: jean</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6730</link>
		<dc:creator>jean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jul 2008 00:58:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6730</guid>
		<description>I think that's great about walking together down the aisle. I remember a lady telling me that the father walking the bride down the aisle was a Protestant tradition. Is that true? 

I wish we'd known sooner in our family. My parents' wedding pictures show my grandfather looking like he's at a funeral as he walks with my mother. My brother started biting his lip when he walked my niece, too! It's a miserable time for fond fathers.

The one time I discussed this with my father, he said the in-laws could give away the groom if they wanted, but he'd keep me until the future in-laws coughed up a handsome sum!  (I don't think a stand-off in church is a good way to start a marriage, do you?)

I don't mind dancing the YMCA, the Chicken Dance or the Hokey-Pokey. But I HATE the "dollar dance" that's so popular. I can't decide whether it's low-grade extortion or sexless prostitution. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that&#8217;s great about walking together down the aisle. I remember a lady telling me that the father walking the bride down the aisle was a Protestant tradition. Is that true? </p>
<p>I wish we&#8217;d known sooner in our family. My parents&#8217; wedding pictures show my grandfather looking like he&#8217;s at a funeral as he walks with my mother. My brother started biting his lip when he walked my niece, too! It&#8217;s a miserable time for fond fathers.</p>
<p>The one time I discussed this with my father, he said the in-laws could give away the groom if they wanted, but he&#8217;d keep me until the future in-laws coughed up a handsome sum!  (I don&#8217;t think a stand-off in church is a good way to start a marriage, do you?)</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t mind dancing the YMCA, the Chicken Dance or the Hokey-Pokey. But I HATE the &#8220;dollar dance&#8221; that&#8217;s so popular. I can&#8217;t decide whether it&#8217;s low-grade extortion or sexless prostitution. <img src='http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Joseph Waldman</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6726</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph Waldman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jul 2008 22:26:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6726</guid>
		<description>Well, get on him, damn it.  Golf is no good without music.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, get on him, damn it.  Golf is no good without music.</p>
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		<title>By: Kasia</title>
		<link>http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6725</link>
		<dc:creator>Kasia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jul 2008 21:20:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://clamrampant.stblogs.com/2008/07/12/music-is-settled-well-almost/#comment-6725</guid>
		<description>He used to, but he doesn't any more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>He used to, but he doesn&#8217;t any more.</p>
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